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End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 9:35am
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Hi Chris, I know its a bit too early. I wanted to start revising for exam during 
tuition free week and Easter break. Is current exam description accurate knowing the 
remote studying circumstances? 

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 9:39am
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No, nothing yet certain, certainly not its format,
other than it contributing 60%.

It will be centred around medium-length written answers, as with past exams, but I don't (even) 
yet know if diagrams will be possible.

End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 12:13pm
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Chris, it would be great if you could tell us about the details of this exam ASAP so we're able to 
get more of an accurate idea of how this will be conducted and the expectations of students. 

On a side note I am very skeptical of this exam format as I am not sure how fairness will actually be 
enforced, how my data will be used (based on the concerns raised by Edward) and how everyone's 
results will be affected because of student mental health during this crisis.

Hope to hear from you soon!

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 12:22pm
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ANONYMOUS wrote:

> Chris, it would be great if you could tell us about the details of this exam ASAP so we're able to 
> get more of an accurate idea of how this will be conducted and the expectations of students.

Yes, fully appreciated.
I am not sitting around delaying this decision; I'm waiting for our forthcoming meetings with other academic staff 
discussing ideas about how to run final exams, and awaiting a demonstration of how it is anticipated ExamSoft will 
be used.


> On a side note I am very skeptical of this exam format as I am not sure how fairness will actually be 
> enforced, how my data will be used (based on the concerns raised by Edward) and how everyone's 
> results will be affected because of student mental health during this crisis.

That's not a side note, that's an important issue.
I believe the majority of staff and students are concerned about the integrity of the assessment process, but 
resigned to the fact that there'll be no perfect solution.

There's still a lot of unknowns, or things that haven't been announced.  For example, it's unclear if most CITS 
coursework units will have the option of Ungraded Passes, as they're all part of accredited degree programmes.
This will be discussed at another Faculty Teaching meeting tomorrow.

End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 9:44pm
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"Christopher McDonald" <chris.                     wrote:

> There's still a lot of unknowns, or things that haven't been announced.  For example, it's unclear if most CITS 
> coursework units will have the option of Ungraded Passes, as they're all part of accredited degree programmes.
> This will be discussed at another Faculty Teaching meeting tomorrow.

If I don't care about being accredited by the ACS, can I just take the ungraded pass and not be "accredited"?

End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Mon 6th Apr, 11:17pm
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Related to my previous question, I'm taking Computer Science as a second major, and according to the ACS 
(https://www.acs.org.au/cpd-education/accredited-courses.html) the Computer Science major is only accredited if taken as a 
degree-specific major in a Bachelor of Science or Bachelor of Philosophy.

Does that mean that students taking Computer Science as a second major wouldn't be accredited, and hence would be able to take 
an ungraded pass regardless of what applies for students taking CS as a degree-specific major? Or would a potential "no 
ungraded pass" rule be applied to the whole cohort?

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Tue 7th Apr, 3:48am
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ANONYMOUS wrote:

> If I don't care about being accredited by the ACS, can I just take the ungraded pass and not be "accredited"?

I don't know, but I doubt that that would be an option -
neither accredited, or not, is printed on your academic transcript.

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Tue 7th Apr, 3:53am
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ANONYMOUS wrote:

> Related to my previous question, I'm taking Computer Science as a second major, and according to the ACS 
> (https://www.acs.org.au/cpd-education/accredited-courses.html) the Computer Science major is only accredited if taken as a 
> degree-specific major in a Bachelor of Science or Bachelor of Philosophy.
> 
> Does that mean that students taking Computer Science as a second major wouldn't be accredited, and hence would be able to take 
> an ungraded pass regardless of what applies for students taking CS as a degree-specific major? Or would a potential "no 
> ungraded pass" rule be applied to the whole cohort?

This is the very question, asked by many students via email too, and will be discussed in a Faculty meeting today.

There are similarly students from other degrees taking just one or two CITS units as electives.
It's unclear if this UP matter applies to whole degrees (and hence all its units), or just individual units.
But I doubt that any decision will be on a person-by-person basis.

End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Tue 7th Apr, 4:12pm
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"Christopher McDonald" <chris.                     wrote:

> ANONYMOUS wrote:
> 
> > Related to my previous question, I'm taking Computer Science as a second major, and according to the ACS 
> > (https://www.acs.org.au/cpd-education/accredited-courses.html) the Computer Science major is only accredited if taken as a 
> > degree-specific major in a Bachelor of Science or Bachelor of Philosophy.
> > 
> > Does that mean that students taking Computer Science as a second major wouldn't be accredited, and hence would be able to take 
> > an ungraded pass regardless of what applies for students taking CS as a degree-specific major? Or would a potential "no 
> > ungraded pass" rule be applied to the whole cohort?
> 
> This is the very question, asked by many students via email too, and will be discussed in a Faculty meeting today.
> 
> There are similarly students from other degrees taking just one or two CITS units as electives.
> It's unclear if this UP matter applies to whole degrees (and hence all its units), or just individual units.
> But I doubt that any decision will be on a person-by-person basis.

Please keep us updated Chris.

Also worth considering is that UNSW is giving pass/fail for all their engineering courses (including CS), and they're accredited by the ACS. 
Surely if UNSW is doing it then UWA can do it too.

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Wed 8th Apr, 6:48am
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ANONYMOUS wrote:

> Please keep us updated Chris.
> 
> Also worth considering is that UNSW is giving pass/fail for all their engineering courses (including CS), and they're accredited by the ACS. 
> Surely if UNSW is doing it then UWA can do it too.

I certainly agree with your last sentence.
UWA is simply waiting on replies from EA and ACS (and Inst. of Physics, Chemical Inst., .....)
to ensure they get the correct message, rather than just making a lone decision.
Sounds like UNSW already have their answer, so UWA's answer should be quick in arriving.

While many students rightly view the UP option as a way to reduce their stress,
it would be a great shame if an incorrect blanket decision resulted in many students not
being able to work as accredited engineers, etc, particularly in other countries requiring it.
(Personally) I'd be pretty annoyed if I couldn't get a working visa in the US because I didn't
have an accredited degree.

End of semester exam

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From: Jared J.
Date: Wed 8th Apr, 7:33am
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"Christopher McDonald" <chris.                     wrote:


> While many students rightly view the UP option as a way to reduce their stress,
> it would be a great shame if an incorrect blanket decision resulted in many students not
> being able to work as accredited engineers, etc, particularly in other countries requiring it.
> (Personally) I'd be pretty annoyed if I couldn't get a working visa in the US because I didn't
> have an accredited degree.

How important is being accredited in a software engineering career? I am(was) a mining engineer and it was very common to have people working as mining engineers without a degree.

End of semester exam

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From: ANONYMOUS
Date: Thu 16th Apr, 10:28am
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Any updates on ungraded pass Chris?

End of semester exam

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From: Christopher M.
Date: Thu 16th Apr, 10:30am
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ANONYMOUS wrote:

> Any updates on ungraded pass Chris?

None yet.
UWA, centrally, strongly wants to go with ExamSoft, and has come back to unit coordinators 
for more opinions and alternatives.

End of semester exam

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From: Edward A.
Date: Thu 16th Apr, 1:46pm
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Sent to my student email about an hour ago

>Therefore we can offer the option of an ungraded pass to both undergraduate and postgraduate students in our degrees.
>
>Students are able to choose the ungraded pass if they wish without compromising accreditation. There are some >exceptions to this.
>
>    UP will not be available in the research project units in Honours.
>    UP will not be available in the research project units in the Master of Data Science.  
>    UP is available for the MPE Research Project (Part 2) but choosing an UP will likely prevent you from pursuing a >higher degree by research (eg PhD) as one of the key entry requirements is a research project with high grade.
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